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Jake it will never work.  Where are the government kickbacks and payoffs?  And what about the Unions, how do they get their cut??

:*)

RagingDebate.com - Ed Bradford
Ed Bradford
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You forgot one thing. There are 12,000,000 illegal aliens in this country, many of whom have jobs. Should all those illegal aliens with jobs disappear, the effect on the unemployment rate would be immediate and profound. Raising the penalty on employers of illegal aliens and offering a reward for reporting the employers would suffice to make the problem go away. One must wonder, what effect 12,000,000 minimum wage or below minimum wage workers have on the scale of wages in this country. It seems to me an unlimited supply of minimum or below minimum wage labor would effect pay scales far beyond the miniimum wage.

RagingDebate.com - BekaForney
BekaForney
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"As seen by the USSR's example, economic central planning never works". Agreed.

It's been said before, but I'll say it again. The free market can take care of itself!

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The small business person is the job creator in America and they are the ones who will lead the nation out of the economic state we are in. We MUST reduce their tax load.

I, for one, believe that the Federal and State income tax needs to be abolished, along with business tax.  A consumption tax, such as sales, is much more fair. And it would be applied to ALL sales, no exceptions. This way the emploee and employer can both be taxed at effectively the same rate.

More importantly though, government spending MUST be cut. 10% ACROSS the board to start would be a good neighborhood.

 

We are in a $14 Trillion hole here folks, and it gets deeper by the second. If we don't do something, and I mean like yesterday, it will be too late. The clocks ticking.

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For the life of me I can't see how any of this improves the common wheal of the average American human.

Maybe it gets a few of them the indignity of a craphole job at less than subsistence wages. Maybe it churns all the numbers about on some economic theorists charts and graphs. Maybe it hits all the hot buttons for folks of a certain economic and political ideology.

The simple fact of the matter remains that unfettered free markets are nothing more than theoretical. Where they have been implemented to any degree, they have caused social upheaval and have been short lived, collapsing in on themselves under the weight of basic common sense.

The problem isn't government. The problem isn't business. The problem is that people just refuse to behave properly for any iron clad ideology. People are wiggly and squishy. They make poor ingredients in any kind of social cooking.

RagingDebate.com - Anonymous
Anonymous
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in order to employ workers, a market is needed. MARKET FOR PRODUCT----- thats what no politician wants to talk about, since most of them were testically void and complicent in sending our manufacturing base to slaver countries. like obama recently said at his meeting with all his elected cronies, " we cant piss off the chicoms and we have to let our shitty trade agreements go on, so we can see if the rape works in 4 or 5 years".

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Why do economist, with all their perceived wisdom, continue in vain to nail fog to a wall? All I can see from where I sit is blinkered, bloody minded academics and professionals desperately trying to force a square peg into an ever changing hole. You cannot expect complex social and ecological models to follow outdated and rigid economic models. It doesn't work like that, it isn't working and it doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Linea and cyclical don't mix, math and chaos dont mix. Lets not get on to technological unemployment, unless you want to?

I am reminded of the scene from James Camerons' The Abyss. Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio has drowned and Ed Harris is sat astride her limp and lifeless body, trying desperately to revive her. As time ticks on his efforts become more and more hysterical as those around him have lost all hope of a recovery. His panic swells and turns to anger as he violently slaps the inanimate Mastrantonio,screaming at her to "fight, fight goddamit!" Fortunately his efforts are rewarded, his love is saved and their relationship enters a new era. For me this is where the similarities end.

Peace 

RagingDebate.com - BOBBY
BOBBY
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When you open the flood gates to FREE TRADE you killed America..and congress knows it...

RagingDebate.com - bobby
bobby
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but this is exactly what has led you to this point of resolution of what free trade has done to corporations for years.

RagingDebate.com - bobby
bobby
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Jake who owns the Car market: toyota and Honda...China has one third of the steel market , the united states has 1/10 !  Come on Jake, do I go with the textile industry and the rest?

RagingDebate.com - bobby
bobby
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Jake, Drive to Detroit and tell me about the auto industry,  50% unemployment, average cost of a house in Detroit has dropped to

20,000. Toyota and Honda have large lobbyists and Govenors who endorsed these plants here with large tax brakes and perks.

RagingDebate.com - Maria Folsom
Maria Folsom
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Nobody responded really gets it. Of course there are "government kickbacks." That is why we DO NOT HAVE a free market! Get rid of those perks and subsidies and the free market will work. Not just a theory! When you open the flood gates to free trade, as Bobby puts it, you get: 1) cheaper prices for goods; 2) therefore more money in the pockets of ordinary Americans who will then 3) spend that money on other goods which therefore 4) create new jobs or support existing ones, and around it goes. Bobby stops short of this and ends his scenario at the borders of America. 

When we spend money on foreign goods, where do you think that spent money will go? Dollars have to come back to America to be worth anything. The concept of "foreign" is meaningless in terms of economics. We are one big, consuming, dynamic, ambitious globe full of people who want THINGS.

Besides, no one is talking about freedom. Don't I have the freedom to purchase from whomever I please? To deal with whatever companies I choose? 

Laissez faire!

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Laissez faire!

I agree.  Markets know no national or political boundaries.

The national game of division creates an appearance of national competition but I believe that a national elite's biggest adversaries are its own people. The "national game" throws a blanket of deception on that. It's the classic power struggle between supply and demand in a traditionally supply driven paradigm.

We're one world, economically.  Keeping the boundaries for political , legal and cultural reasons is understandable and fine, but there doesn't need to be an economic divide among people who wish to trade.

The old boys are apt to spring a global fiat currency on us in due time. We can collectively and organically beat them to the punch by creating wide spread use of gold and silver as market currency.  It's up to each person as to what currency they choose to use.

Now that gold and silver bullion's weighted title (Fully backed) can be digitized and transfered anywhere via the internet, this enhances buillion liquidity to the point of great simplicity. Let the asset based market currencies rule the competition with debt currencies.

The long awaited marriage between the weight and the measure in real-time is here ..... and now !

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